Post by Jian Oreachi on Jun 20, 2016 0:25:10 GMT -5
Well sure, but that sort of reflection is part and parcel the editting aspect of writing. Unlike it that we don't go back and rewrite and tweak but simply presenting and summarizing the story we're telling is a good thing and I'm not sure there's a better way to do it, save instead of writing it just voice chatting or something.
Edit: I find it's less about feedback and more about the process of looking back and framing your writing.
Last Edit: Jun 20, 2016 0:26:13 GMT -5 by Jian Oreachi
Which I do. By myself. In my head. In a way that makes sense to me but is very hard to put down on paper for others to understand, especially in a milestone. Easier in casual conversation, not so easy in a milestone.
So, what I have here in the spoilers is our current "Death Rules" for how a player can die. Seeing them now, I cringe a bit at my language, but here we are.
Death is a very real, very present threat for virtually each and every character on Bleach Gotei. Whether or not we, the writers, ever plan on having it happen does not completely stop it from happening under the right circumstances. There are four major ways in which death is going to occur.
First, and perhaps the easiest, it may simply make sense for the character to meet their end at the hands of a rival or in a particularly bloody fight. In this case, all players involved 'agree' that the character is going to die and this request serves simply as a notification for staff of what has occurred, and so we can assist you in acquiring Death GP for your next adventure. If this method is going to be used, a quick post from the deceased character's writer stating they consent would be much appreciated.
Second, writers may pursue character death as a means of furthering their story. Humans can die and their misery may turn them into a Hollow. Hollows can be purified and wake up in the Rukongai. The list goes on but the result is the same - the character continues on in a different form despite this 'setback'. If this is the avenue you are taking, you should redirect your efforts to the "Race Change Request" above, as there are special rules regarding a death resulting in a race change.
Third, a character may find themselves in a situation where death has not been agreed to. Most commonly, this can occur if a character is in the middle of combat but extenuating circumstances lead to their leaving the site without warning for at least sixty days. If this has occurred a Death Request may be filed where you are asked to prove that death is a convincing and likely outcome to the situation. Make no mistake, the burden of proof here is high. It is our preference that you leave an afk writer with a chance to come back and pick up their story, but if you are locked in a battle with a bitter rival, we would not want you to ignore the only course of action that would make sense.
Fourth and finally, an unwilling death. These occur in circumstances where a character's actions repeatedly invite death at the hands of their thread partner(s), and even though they are unwilling to die, there is truly no other alternative than for one to kill the other. This is, without a doubt, the rarest of the methods. Consequences are real, and there comes a point where those involved must be true to the considered actions of their character and attempt murder against a transgressor. Be aware of who you provoke in character, you may bite off more than you can chew.
Please see the "Stats and Skills" Rules post and look for the section explaining Character Expiration, for a description of how Death GP works.
And now I am going to re-write them per this discussion we've had, and you guys can discuss with me "what's not okay" down below. This is obviously not intended to get at issues with my grammar or whatever, just purely content, message, clarity. Let's go!
Character Death Request
Name: <Name of Killer> Target: <The Deceased>
What am I applying for?
Death is a very real part of the setting of Bleach Gotei. Sometimes the only way a situation can resolve is when one or more characters do not come out of a thread alive. While organic storytelling needs to allow for this possibility, instances where this happens against the will of the character's writer should be both rare and extremely limited. There are three major ways in which death might occur.
First, and easiest. It may simply be the intention of your story for your character to die. All events leading up to this have pointed to one last stand, or the conclusion of a long rivalry, or the ultimate cost to a tragic mistake. Whatever the circumstance, this is a scenario that is wanted by the character. In this situation, the 'Death Request' functions to do little more than just give Staff a heads-up that this is occurring. If the Players are happy, everyone wins.
Second, and most common. Writers may pursue character death as a way of moving their story along to 'the next chapter'. Humans can die and be consumed in their misery, becoming a Hollow. Arrancar can be purified and wake up in the Rukongai. The list goes on but the results are the same -- the character continues on in a different form, but with the same 'soul' of the Character. If this is the route you are taking, you should be using the "Race Change Request" form, and not this one.
Third, and exceedingly rare. Sometimes, against all advice and forewarning, and in the face of every opportunity to defer the consequences, a character may court death over and over until it finally comes calling. In this event, one character is attempting to kill another against the will of that character's Player. Circumstances that might result in something like this should come with very obvious cues, and it is the duty of those who might do the killing to communicate the likely outcome. Long-time, bitter rivals clashing for the third and final time. Or a lowly Hollow walking into the Seireitei and demanding to sit in on a Captain's Meeting. Unlike other methods of death, it is the duty of the thread partner and the expectation of Staff to get involved and actively seek to find alternatives that do not result in Character Death. If, and only if, all other options are exhausted would this Death Request be granted.
Which I do. By myself. In my head. In a way that makes sense to me but is very hard to put down on paper for others to understand, especially in a milestone. Easier in casual conversation, not so easy in a milestone.
Let's cut to the chase then: There is no useful critical method that conforms to what you want because you don't want a critical method, you're just looking for validation. I mean that with the fullest respect and in the best spirit of the term.
Something I was kicking around in my head last night and managed to stick there until this morning...
1) Anyone who does not want to participate in a traditional Milestone, for whatever reason, regardless of reason, qualifies.
2) You submit a stack of threads, with a 1-3 sentence summary of the events. No plans, or explanation, or self-evaluation or summarizing. Just a list of threads.
3) We add +500 to your Base GP up to a maximum, based on your "rank" (So Pre-Second-Power is one bracket, then After-Second-Power but Pre-Prestige, and then Prestige+) No questions asked, no debate and award. The drawback to this is that your Base cannot go beyond a certain number. In this way, you cannot avoid doing Advancement Requests, but you can avoid the problems with Milestones that people are pointing out.
What do people think about that?
I'd imagine you could change your mind and go back to normal Milestones after switching brackets.
Quick and dirty Math in my head says 1,500-3,000 is bracket I, 3,000-4,500 is bracket II, and 4,500+ is bracket III but I'd have to test that out. Obvious the number of threads per each is an important thing, HOWEVER, it doesn't matter one single bit for this discussion.
Edit: Yes, there is no bracket explicitly for Post-Prestige by intention.
Last Edit: Jun 20, 2016 7:51:12 GMT -5 by Consequence
Which I do. By myself. In my head. In a way that makes sense to me but is very hard to put down on paper for others to understand, especially in a milestone. Easier in casual conversation, not so easy in a milestone.
Let's cut to the chase then: There is no useful critical method that conforms to what you want because you don't want a critical method, you're just looking for validation. I mean that with the fullest respect and in the best spirit of the term.
Something I was kicking around in my head last night and managed to stick there until this morning...
1) Anyone who does not want to participate in a traditional Milestone, for whatever reason, regardless of reason, qualifies.
2) You submit a stack of threads, with a 1-3 sentence summary of the events. No plans, or explanation, or self-evaluation or summarizing. Just a list of threads.
3) We add +500 to your Base GP up to a maximum, based on your "rank" (So Pre-Second-Power is one bracket, then After-Second-Power but Pre-Prestige, and then Prestige+) No questions asked, no debate and award. The drawback to this is that your Base cannot go beyond a certain number. In this way, you cannot avoid doing Advancement Requests, but you can avoid the problems with Milestones that people are pointing out.
What do people think about that?
I'd imagine you could change your mind and go back to normal Milestones after switching brackets.
Quick and dirty Math in my head says 1,500-3,000 is bracket I, 3,000-4,500 is bracket II, and 4,500+ is bracket III but I'd have to test that out. Obvious the number of threads per each is an important thing, HOWEVER, it doesn't matter one single bit for this discussion.
Edit: Yes, there is no bracket explicitly for Post-Prestige by intention.
To clarify so my foggy head can fully wrap around this thought, you mean that you could submit 'milestones' in the form of some threads and a summary to earn 500 GP flat, no questions asked no more no less, but you can't go beyond a certain amount of total GP dependent on where your character 'class' falls? So, say, you don't have your second release and you're using this method. You started off with the 1.5k base. You can do a total of 3 of these, theoretically, to reach a say, imaginary cap of 3k?
Sorry to be troublesome by I assume directly paraphrasing your suggestion.
We're singing I believe that lovers should be chained together and thrown into a fire with their songs and letters, and left there to burn. Left there to burn in their arrogance.
Totally writing out character death strikes me, very deeply, as wrong. Stating that we will do anything and everything in our power to avoiding it, and putting a 'rule' behind that, is a pretty healthy accommodation.
I like and fully agree on the new Character Death rules. It's fair, concise, and it gives options while at the same time making sure that it's either for the character's betterment / story. Or after other routes have been worked out. All in all, I don't think there's anything anyone could find disagreeable with it.
And yeah, completely writing out death is wrong. After all, some stories really do benefit from death, but your accommodation is a good one.
Post by Consequence on Jun 20, 2016 8:43:10 GMT -5
That is correct, Cheshire. That's what I was proposing.
You trade the necessity of feedback and "approval" for a reduced maximum, but it's better than having characters like Obsession milestone once in 8 years.
BG actually has a history of trying to re-assess ourselves in the spring/summer. It's good that we are willing to adapt and change...but I'd rather we just write sometimes.
Are any of toki's recent propositions doing away with written gp?
Post by Consequence on Jun 20, 2016 10:27:55 GMT -5
While I appreciate the spirit this proposal was offered in, and there was some good discussion about Death on BG, I don't think anyone has adequately tapped into anything larger that we need to keep debating and looking for a solution to.
So, I'd love to leave this open yet today for any more debate and contribution, but I'll be 'closing this and moving on' by the end of tonight in the interests of not doing damage unintentionally.
By making Milestones the sole source of GP. This means we'd have to summarize absolutely everything we thread IC, which from what I can tell is what everyone does already, or at least the Veteran Members. I can get behind this Idea because it makes it easy to see where you are and how you got there. Again as a Milestone it does make it harder to grow if that is the only source of GP for newer players who just joined and haven't gotten adjusted to this style of doing things. Immediate changes tend to Deter most noobs, though for some it just gives them additional motivation.
As the whole Killing thing is concerned. I don't care how emotionally invest I am into any of my characters, If the death is clean then I don't wanna weasel my way out of death for the sake of attachment, I'd rather let my death boost someone to where they want to go then deny them a potential milestone.
Is character growth slow going? I don't know for sure being I am new to all of this but the slow growth should be kept for someone to get their bearings when first joining, and rapid growth available where necessary for keeping up with the ever growing "godlike" population.
I enjoy the Idea of GP transference when one character is 'retired/killed' to a new character someone wants to start. It helps them get where they want to go fresh out the gate while using the previously gained experience to rejoin in Major Events. Though I can see where this can be an issue for some who might see it as 'unfair' that this new character merely a day old can already compete with someone who has been a member for a while and makes them feel like they are at a disadvantage.
Any radical or complete overall changes to the site might make newer members drop out completely which hurts the community from growing. We are after all a Community that wants to grow and welcome new players.
The raising the 'soft cap' I don't know enough to actually have an opinion about this but overall I feel things right now are where they need to be for growing the community. Now if you are proposing we make a second forum for the more advanced players to transfer over to in order to test out these new methods or Ideas then that should happen. A test run for those willing to participate to find any bugs and work on them. If it works out then keep it, if not then let it fade.
Malix here signing off
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