Post by Bastian Kruger on Sept 26, 2016 20:26:04 GMT -5
Hi, I'm new here! I'm going to be playing a Quincy with this character Bastian and would be happy to help with OOC organization and things. Also when I make a second character some time in the future it will surely be Hollow-Breed or Arrancar so I'd be glad to provide help there too.
If the problem with Arrancar is they can't get out of the gate without getting beaten up what if we just did something like, for the remainder of 2016 all new Arrancar characters will automatically get the full 1500 bonus GP on their app? Perhaps with a caveat of saying they must have written it well enough to have gotten at least 500 or something, so that their app isn't just cat gifs. That would given them a significant boost without overdoing it, no?
Post by Murat Pasha on Sept 26, 2016 23:36:34 GMT -5
No offense intended, but that sounds like a kind of iffy idea, Bastian. Someone who makes an Aran/Hollow shouldn't get rewarded on the same level as a perfect application, and it shouldn't be done in a way that prevents them from even trying beyond a certain point on the app. If there's bonus GP given out, it should be independent of the app and based upon actually putting the work in, especially since it would be able to reward a good app AND use of the character, rather than just making a character.
Last Edit: Sept 26, 2016 23:40:01 GMT -5 by Murat Pasha
Regarding the complete lack of Hollow and Arrancar and the difficulties people face in getting a firm grasp/getting to a point where they're able to feel like they can RP without getting their teeth completely kicked in by literally everyone but the lowest tier Shinigami, Mortal, and Quincy... what are thoughts on an incentive GP bonus for those who complete a total of 3 to 5 collaborative threads for all new Hollow/Arrancar characters?
As a reward for doing so, they qualify for a one time only Las Noches Population Boom of 2016-2017 reward in the form of xxx to xxxx GP. (I'm thinking a cool sum of 500 to at most 1000 GP?) to help give said race a swift kick up in the pants and potentially generate some more interest and/or players who can legit plot out how to be more like the antagonists they should, instead of the site's whipping boys/girls as they presently are/have been.
I'd have said something similar for Quincy, but we're having a pretty good population boom of them, so they're not in any danger.
- has super amazing Q - character has tons of synergy w/ everyone she meets - character is well loved by everyone - still cant prestige her, let alone make it to Sanrei
b-but Kireon, if even you couldnt do it
the number of exaggerations out of your mouth is truly astonishing. Sit down. Also those 'in the know' understand why I had to backburner her.
Last Edit: Sept 26, 2016 23:46:27 GMT -5 by Kireon
A bonus to me reeks of those looking for a bower boost in my opinion. Maybe forced 2nd race. So to speak I made a shinigami so if I choose to make a 2nd character he can't be one, I need to pick a new race. Also forces people to see struggles from differant views. Also rule it I can't make another one till all races have been used makes race diversity.with the right rules in place I think that might work.
" Its a fighting fire with fire kinda thing..... only with cold
But I do agree, have arroncar maybe they should start off stronger with there base gp by like 500 or so give them a more powerful feel as they have gone through a certain point of evolution.
" Its a fighting fire with fire kinda thing..... only with cold
If you guys would like I'll start work on your antagonist sounds like fun as I've never played a truly evil character but if you want Since the site needs it. I can try.
" Its a fighting fire with fire kinda thing..... only with cold
Post by Bastian Kruger on Sept 27, 2016 2:57:01 GMT -5
While I understand the idea of it as being a reward for completing several threads that would mean they have to get through several threads without getting the snot beaten out of the by everyone and if they could do that we wouldn't be having this problem, no? Or are several threads a reasonable amount of time to go without getting into a fight?
A bonus to me reeks of those looking for a bower boost in my opinion. Maybe forced 2nd race. So to speak I made a shinigami so if I choose to make a 2nd character he can't be one, I need to pick a new race. Also forces people to see struggles from differant views. Also rule it I can't make another one till all races have been used makes race diversity.with the right rules in place I think that might work.
But I do agree, have arroncar maybe they should start off stronger with there base gp by like 500 or so give them a more powerful feel as they have gone through a certain point of evolution.
If you guys would like I'll start work on your antagonist sounds like fun as I've never played a truly evil character but if you want Since the site needs it. I can try.
Sweetie, there's an edit button. XD Use that next time instead of triple posting, 'kay? Thank you! <3
To address your concerns:
We have a small handful of Hollow and Arrancar at this point in time; none of them fit for leadership and every single one of them (with the exception of our two Prestige Arrancar, Takua and Nazomi) are likely to be utterly annihilated by the majority of Shinigami, Variants, and Quincy. Giving the existing characters a 'free bonus' isn't going to do a whole lot of good-- particularly when very few of them are legitimately being played at present. (Cazador, Vern, Octavia, Morg; I'm lookin' at y'all right now, thank you for being active!)
The point of having them complete a set number of threads in order to gain that 500-1000 GP reward is to ensure we don't have a bunch of people applying for a free GP bonus straight off the app-- only to abandon them before the end of their first/at the end of the first thread, making another Arrancar/Hollow, rinse, repeat until they get a score they're "happy" with. It makes them take their time to really roleplay the character, get established, etc as a result. Most of the time? You know within your first 5 threads if this character is going to work/go somewhere, or if you're going back to the drawing board. Murat already explained this reasoning incredibly well too!
While I understand the idea of it as being a reward for completing several threads that would mean they have to get through several threads without getting the snot beaten out of the by everyone and if they could do that we wouldn't be having this problem, no? Or are several threads a reasonable amount of time to go without getting into a fight?
Unexpected fights/skirmishes are fairly uncommon here, oddly enough! I've only gotten into 4 fights during this particular character's story. Three of which were very roughly planned/sketched out. One of which was completely unexpected. (Hi Arty! <3) Most of the players here are more than willing to sit down via PM/PC/Discord and bounce ideas back and forth for thread ideas/routes. If you're having difficulty? You can always ask someone to help generate ideas that won't get you killed and can help you flesh out/show off the sides of your character you'd like to explore the most.
There's also it being very highly dependent on the character's personality; some, like Jian Oreachi, are notorious for getting into fights (and thus getting their shit kicked in because damn it, Jian is a BG motto.) Others, like Nazomi and Takua, are known for either causing Trauma (the former) or trying to help and fucking that up/having it bite them in the ass later (the latter).
Our problem with the Hollow races lay twofold; scarce population (hurts quite a bit) + lack of proper leadership. The latter is something that can be amended with the former-- so long as someone legitimately steps up and doesn't just talk the talk.
If your first response to a thread partner is "oh well they're too strong for me" then you're doing it wrong. If it's "I can't do X" because of an event going on or OTHER EXCUSE HERE" then you're doing it wrong. If it's "I might lose any conflict/fight's are the only way I know how to be an antagonist" then you're doing it wrong. Focus on the character. Focus on their goals. Move forward.
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Leadership is nothing new. It's always been pretty shit and will continue to be as long as the same people keep taking up the mantles and doing nothing with it. Stagnation and decay; good times. You want it to change you need to shake things up. Maybe you need to actually put more thought into those ranks and how people get them instead of just "Well I has it deeeeerr" and those wonderful challenges that never amount to a damn thing happening. Except watching Hazuki piss off Miyuki. That's been delightful.
I mean you're about to blow up most of the BAMF list right now. There's never been a better moment to hard reboot the process and the landscape than right now. Otherwise we can sit with the same gaps and the same repetitive bullshit from the same people.
I mean, aside from the fact that Weylin has pretty much just said "Be my waifu and I'll post on my quincy more." Chop chop, Sekai.
But if you're not prepared to actually do things/interact with people instead of flying a "lookit my stepping stone that doesn't matter because I'm pointless!" then maybe don't take up the spot.
If all your plans only involve how it benefits/revolves around only you? Don't take the spot.
If you're going to spend more time talking about what you're going to do instead of doing it, don't take it.
If you're just going to be so lazy as to not even try to understand how anything is supposed to work and instead resort to godmodding and power playing maybe swallow bleach. Not making a pun, I literally want you to drink the chemical and die. And yes, it's a problem I've seen creeping up bit by bit. The players that do it need to be called on it. And they need to recognize when they do it and fucking stop.
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And I'm going to side eye the whole "Free gp for playing with X". I get the point of incentive but the numbers have to remain relatively small (but enough to actually provide the motivation.) or you're asking for bloating as far as growth goes. Which, coincidentally, gets in the way of actual character development. If it weren't as high as you're suggesting I could see it being somewhat effective but not the sort of thing that resolves the problem in of itself. Address the core and work out, is what I'm saying in this case. This can work, but other things would need to be touched on first. I think coming back to it as something to do (for all characters) once other things are discussed is actually a great idea.
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The problem being people are bitches about whether they win or lose fights. About a number of things, actually, but I'll try to stay on point. Pull your ego out of the equation and maybe that helps.
The problem is in mentality and atmosphere and neither gets addressed. No rule is going to fix that. It's more reliant on your own ability, addressing everyone, to get your head out of your ass and stop doing those things.
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App times take forever. Why? You itemized it into a checklist. Whether you "personally guarantee" it or not, you gave them a means to try game the system. You removed rp sample, which was a slowdown, but kept "snapshots" instead of letting people write the history that is pertinent to the character. Aside from being gimmicky and clunky, you're forcing newer players to try and work in things that won't matter or could be included into history itself. Maybe use that check list of yours as a standard. If the point is to absorb them into the community itself as bloodlessly as possible? Then focusing on the competency and expectations makes everything that comes AFTER easier. In theory. Older players will be more willing to welcome them in and newer ones have a larger pool of people to play with sooner rather than later.
So how about you change that? Not just the snapshots but the GP too. Maybe, instead of handing out chunks of starting gp based on how well they can present the app? You give a flat rate. I'd say so much starting Reiatsu for free but that's not necessary, even though it would be MUCH MORE helpful in getting them started faster. And that's the goal. Get them started faster and without spending inordinate amounts of time trying to "put out a high score app!". Because as has been pointed out to every new member "The app is the least important part of your character." And yet...
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Let's talk the request roadblocks while we're at it hmm?
Set aside the shit show of "getting too much" that is Transcendent. Because for something "no one plays/end game" they have a lot of potential power abuse. Again, your personal guarantees don't really matter. Giving them the sort of power they get automatically now is either pointless, in which case they didn't need it, or will back fire when someone gets pissy about things not going their way. You saying "nope, illegal" doesn't put that jack back in the box. No matter what fucking bar you set. But why am I talking about them still? Oh well see, that's the point. They get OH SO MUCH automatically for a group that has had the least impact and need.
Why are they the only ones? Your player base encompasses more than those four people.
If you're going to make things symmetrical then let's talk relaxing some of that for second and third release. Broken is a shit show anyways so not even going to address it/its not the point when we need a base for discussion anyways. Maybe something needs a free mastery or two in there. No I'm not suggesting their value diminish in the long run. I'm suggesting leveling the playing field.
Tak and Weylin are the exceptions to the rule. Most people are never going to top 3, 4 at the outside without breaking their ability to maintain a steady flow of posts. The person that is going to write THAT GOD DAMNED MUCH FOR A FUCKING REQUEST TOPIC to get 7+ masteries is STILL always going to do that. If the goal is to make things faster and more welcoming, doing something in this regard would probably accomplish that. Not everyone can sell themselves as well as required to higher end and the idea that requests have not diminished to that is naive.
If they've passed the base standards (Which again, start at the source with your expectations and everything else should follow) and are good enough to get the next release? I don't see the harm in it. It still requires gp for them to invest and you WANT gp sinks. Not because the rate needs to be slower (goodness fucking no.) but because the people who are in need of them, prestige+, don't. Instead we get Jian who jumps up to 400 because he's been hording GP like Gollum with Fish Dicks. Granted, he also writes A LOT. But then again, so did Sekai. And Tak...and oh look Frey just JUMPED to 300 (Because she forgot numbers, but still). It benefits everyone and provides a naturally occurring gp expenditure.
"naturally occurring" being the key words. Minimal fuss. As opposed to upending the entire gp scale to try and compensate.
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The variant request is unnecessary. Your argument is not valid. It has never been valid. Shinigami and Quincy drop with higher frequency and neither needs the extra step. If your concern is that they might not have focus this is something you should be addressing in the app phase, not by adding another hoop that they have to jump through to even attempt the application. It's a deterrent to anyone that might feel inclined to play one.
Extra steps directed at only one group are a bad bias to have.
That said you can help give them some more focus in how they're set up. You need an actual power skill for non-fullbringers. I say this because mortals lack one outside that. Everyone writes their power as a unique manifestation and that's a bit aimless. They need something in the vein of Fullbringer, of Zanpaktou Resonance, Hollow Evolution, and so forth. They need something that encompasses where their abilities, the manifestation of their power, comes from. I talked with you about this once, Toki. I still think it applies. You give them a focus for their growth when it comes to masteries and thus makes the entire process much more painless. There are more ways, looking at Sekai, that they could be tightened up. Particularly in regards to detailing what their place is supposed to be. Do a bit of world building.
It's fun.
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So, specifics aside? Point I'm trying to get at is a vast majority of how things might improve rely on - Setting your expectations from the gate. If your response is "it drives off people" with what should be minimal requirements then you would otherwise be hurting the forum more than helping by allowing them in. - Needing to do more with leadership positions. If they remain another notch in a belt then we keep getting the same thing we've always gotten. - Making other aspects less time consuming *but not less important* based on the idea that if you have already made your standards clear that everything else should follow. - The above should be applied in ways that benefits the entire player-base. They should get in faster, have a level playing field once they're here, and have the chance to actually accomplish something. - Removing things that slow momentum down is a good thing.
Post by Consequence on Sept 27, 2016 11:30:37 GMT -5
Unfortunately, many things exploded at work today so I don't have time to go through many of the bullet points between my latest reply and this one with any finer grain detail, so I'll just rapid fire a couple things quickly.
1) "Incentives" for applications are a bad, and there will not be a time, ever, where people are awarded max GP without earning it. 2) If some sort of "systemic encouragement" were to ever be given, it would probably come from a bonus GP amount (50 or 25) to any completed thread whose first round includes a Hollow-Breed, for example, if we wanted to stimulate this usergroup. 3) The suggestion in #2 is not something I have any plans to do, that's just probably what form it would take if it were to ever take a form. 4) Applications are about to change to make the History requirements much smaller and make more sense. Snapshots -will be- going away, and this has been under development for about 3 weeks now. It'll be out when I am satisfied it's ready, but this is coming very soon. 5) The perspective of making important things less time consuming, but not any less important, is one I very much share and want to do more with. 6) Discussions about what people should or should not do with rank are not really apt for this thread, as they are 100% a person-by-person issue. I cannot implement anything that forces you to grow as a leader, or step up to the plate. No one can. You either do or you don't, and that's on you.
Post by Bastian Kruger on Sept 27, 2016 13:55:11 GMT -5
If the applications are being streamlined soon should I wait to post my app? I've been working on it and it's nearing completion I just haven't chosen to post it yet.
If the applications are being streamlined soon should I wait to post my app? I've been working on it and it's nearing completion I just haven't chosen to post it yet.
I've already cleared this up on Discord, but I figured I'd post it here as well for visibility: If you are currently working on your application using the current template, you are absolutely welcome to keep using it. You will be graded as usual. Should you find the newer template more convenient when released, you are free to change your current application as well. The choice is yours.
Post by Consequence on Sept 27, 2016 15:29:15 GMT -5
Don't let the pending change stop you from submitting your application. We're still talking "days" before it's out as we settle ways to handle new policy and procedure, as well as polishing before it's affected.
Post by Calendrea Hughes on Sept 29, 2016 16:18:28 GMT -5
Alright. I stumbled across this on accident.
Honestly, I am not the Chit chat sort of person who can just come off with something witty and eye catching to even be paid attention to in something like Discord. Basically, if its in the live chat, I won't see it.
Why? Well naturally my personality is a big factor, but then I am just very much absorbed in trying to work out my history and snapshots in a way that makes sense to the background I wish to have before I get to begin RP.
Anyway, this thread has been enlightening and I will just continue with the application I currently have running. There of course will be things to sync with my brother Bastian Kruger with respect to history.
But I grow so eager to begin RP. I think I have been here 9 days now?