Quincy Existentialism

As a Quincy, you don't have to make a power, but generally they either tie into the character, or come from an established family lineage.

Like Cressida Schade was put down most of her life, but she still got back up. She has gravity alteration powers.

Generally rule of thumb, think outside the box and what to do with reishi. Acid, explosion, etc. Then decide what suites your character

'Let's build a better world' - Sasha

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Honestly, think that being rather ambitious she'll like to investigate, break things apart, (re-)create them, build them, and with Quincy being what they are, it seemed fun to play some Lego.

note I don't really care about your specific powers outside of the context of justification for the progression of them

in the larger scope of the discussion of the underlying themes of a quincy's progress they can certainly be used as examples to highlight your point but I'm not asking "what are your powers and why are they important to your character"

Warning, Head-canon and clusterfucked rambling ahead.
Quincy are a bit of a unique case, I agree. Let's tackle the other two main races first. I won't even bother going into Humans.

I've always seen Shinigami powers as having most of the freedom, especially because of all the examples in the source material. Elemental powers? Sure. Mental powers? Go ahead, yeah, why not? Whatever, anything works to an extent. One theme seems persistent and that is that most of these powers are external: they apply to the weapon, rather than the person (exceptions exist). Inner reiryoku manipulation channelled into the weapon to gain external power.

Hollow-breeds, on the other hand, I see for what they are: beasts. Their powers should, in my head, always have to do with one thing: survival. Improving the probability of staying alive through 'biological' evolution, be that by increasing defence or by giving themselves new means of taking on foes. This also varies in terms of category, but the theme here is that their powers allow them to tackle issues they previously could not. These powers should always have a more 'natural' feel to them for best results. I always ask myself 'how would this have helped them survive?' when thinking up Hollow powers. Internal reiryoku channelled into the body to exert internal power.

So now we have body-centric and weapon-centric powers? What's left? Nothing? I'm not entirely sure myself, but the way I saw it when making Benjamin (and I'll be honest, I didn't spend much time doing so) was that the Quincy have a simple person: rid the world of spiritual beings. Why would they do that? Why the fuck would they care that there's Hollow on earth if there's Shinigami to stop them? Simple, they're unnatural in their eyes. I personally associate Quincy with religion of any type, and thus their powers should reflect this in one way or another. Even in canon there's a clear holy theme associated with the Quincy. From biblical names to blatant stuff like 'Heilig pfeil', Holy Arrow. They eradicate spirits because their belief or God, whatever shape or form it may take, states that they do not belong. For the Quincy without religion, it's not a big stretch to say that while the religion was never passed down, the techniques and mindset was. Religion was big back in the day, no doubt that the Quincy families strove to teach their children to follow the same path while not necessarily following the religion. If they were doing their job, they were without realising also fulfilling the will of a deity.

Keep in mind here that just like with religion in the real world, it doesn't necessarily have to be true. It's about belief here, not necessarily facts. Maybe there is no deity, maybe they're just doing it for nothing. That's no big deal, that happens in the real world all the time.

As for the techniques, a lot (if not all) of them are just specialised uses of Reishi Manipulation. Blut is just manipulating Reishi into your blood vessels. Hirenkyaku is just using Reishi to support your feet in the air and allowing you to 'ride' it. I think a Quincy's personal power should also follow this theme: a specialised use of Reishi manipulation. This also eliminates stuff like elemental manipulation from their tool set, it just doesn't make sense to me.

For Benjamin, this is simply put just manipulating the Reishi in his voice. Wow, not very special. The effect I gave to it ('belief' manipulation, prophet yada yada, nobody cares), however, also tackles the 'divine' theme I feel Quincy should have.


tl;dr

Quincy should have a biblical/divine theme (even if distant) with a Reishi-based power that's not elemental in nature but rather focuses more on 'raw', simple powers.

you're focusing on the nature of the powers rather than the justification for them, which is what I'm concerned about (given the multitude of powers I've seen on BG throughout the years I also think you're wrong but that's not relevant to the discussion at hand)

think of it like this:

Hollow-breeds live in the shadow of their own flaws. Arrancar are defined by what killed them in life, just as Vaizards draw upon whatever it is they hate the most about themselves.

Shinigami are split personalities, a conscious wielding a subconscious. Their sword is a representation of a deeper part of them.

There's a certain deterministic nature to both of these—they exist as products of their environment even if the individual chooses not to see himself as such. They don't control what they are. They simply are. Their powers are weaponized aspects of self: their flaws, their personalities, etc.

Quincy, however, are the opposite. They are defined as mortals with a single unifying trait: the ability to manipulate spiritual matter. Control is central to the race dynamic (and evident in a number of their skills: their casting skill is extremely deliberate and based on area denial and traps, their prestige power skill is Reishi Dominance and there's even a skill in there quite literally named Slavery). Quincy are not products of their environment, their environment is a product of them. They are not subject to destiny or to factors outside of their reach; everything they do they do purposefully and consciously.

They don't have to kill Hollows, but they choose to.

What serves as the underlying basis for the Quincy progression of power therefore is the same conscious choice. They choose how to define themselves by choosing what they use their innate ability for. The manipulation of Reishi serves as justification for their power, but the nature of that power is unique to the Quincy in question because everyone makes different choices. Their powers are an expression of control, of measured action, intentional and purposeful influence on their surroundings. They choose to specialize in something (which becomes their BG powers)

I'd argue that the Skrift isn't something they're born with. If you want to treat it like something beyond their control you may as well be playing an Arrancar with an Aspect of Death. The Skrift is something they adopt as a way of defining themselves, something they see themselves as embodying or perhaps something they aspire to define. It's something I'd expect a responsible Quincy to adopt around the same time they achieve their Second Power, so that they can then become the ultimate expression of that word or phrase as their Fullständig for Prestige.

Quincy do have to kill hollows, it's a matter of survival, hollows are drawn to humans with higher reiatsu, a Quincy can go to space and a hollow would follow, mostly for the fact that a Quincy manipulates reishi from the atmosphere and would be a sitting duck in space.

no, they really don't

in fact, the (misguided) choice to kill hollows is what got them purged by the people who actually have to kill hollows in the first place

Enhanced humans are the most threatened by the hollows, they were (incorrectly) defending themselves, the culling was because the quincy powers are naturally unnatural, oxymoronic? Let me explain, in the quincy history, the first quincies started as general powers, but years of training and refining changed that. And in doing so they upgraded their spiritual carbon footprint with that growing standardization evolution.

Let's take this down a synch, say an animal was being attacked by another who's natural predator was scarce, does the first species not have the right to defend themselves should their defense mechanism (poison for this case) be harmful to the environment?

do uh

do porcupines kill dogs that come sniffing

or do they just stick their barbs out and make themselves unattractive prey?

do turtles kill birds that come pecking

or do they just shell the fuck up and make themselves unattractive prey?

quincy are given the same choice

they can either act irrational and violent, destroy the hollow that comes for them and ultimately suffer the (dire) consequences, or they can make themselves unattractive prey through other means, such as nonlethal traps or bindings or all manner of things

the right to life is nonexistent.

I'm inclined to agree on all points, especially the idea of choice. No arguments with the concepts presented.

The devil is, as always, in the details.

I'm of the opinion that the Schrift isn't something you actively go, "okay here's my word," and then it becomes some supernatural force in your life. It's, at best, something you use to define yourself -- a tradition among Quincy. Unlike the Aspect of Death, or even a Sanrei Device, I don't think it actually exists as a thing.

I also don't think they consciously choose their unique powers. Quincy powers are not innate, they're not born; and that's why Bleach Gotei doesn't actually differentiate between "pure" blooded and other Quincy through its application of, say, Blut. Quincy powers are learned, and that's where the choice comes from. Any spiritually aware Human can choose to be a Quincy.

Which leaves a question: What about their own, natural powers they would have had if they didn't choose to be Quincy? To me, that's what ultimately becomes their unique powers -- such as Lucas' portal ability. It manifests through their learned Quincy power, which is manipulating spiritual particles. From there, their unique abilities as individuals will grant them their own ways of using their spiritual particles that other people simply cannot replicate.

Oh, and, no. Quincy don't need to kill Hollows. But they do anyway, and they have their reasons for it. None of them are rooted in a need for simple survival, though.

Most Quincy I've run into, and this is true in franchise canon too, kill Hollows because they deserve it.

Interesting choices,but Quincy can't make themselves unattractive prey and a hollow becomes more dangerous once they see a Quincy and survive. Also nonlethal can only go so far as to delay the inedible, as a hollow can survive and remember details such as friends, family, location, and any weakness that can be exploited. A Quincy can suppress their reiatsu at master level but do you expect me to believe a child will be locked up since birth until they can, roughly at age 10-13?

That's patently untrue.

If you're able to kill something else, you can expend that effort making it much, much less desirable to try to kill you.

Hollows, although not fundamentally sane creatures, do still possess a sense of self-preservation. If Quincy as a whole made themselves unworthy of the effort and risk, Hollows would leave them alone.

But fuck that, Hollows deserve oblivion.

but then what's the difference between a quincy and a non-quincy mortal? why do we differentiate between the two? why are there established families and long lineages of quincy but not of non-quincy mortals? why is that familial line such a consistent theme among all our quincy players and none of our non-quincy mortals?

the differentiation between pure-blood and non-pure-blood strikes me as a question of lineage and elitism rather than any actual difference, in the same way aristocracy was once viewed, but it's not like the aristocrats were stronger or faster than the peasants

but yeah I don't think the Skrift in itself is anything mystical, it's just a form of derived nom de guerre

a bit like abu otto al-swedi

edit literally anything can make itself unattractive prey what are you talking about

I don't think we disagree on the 'why' and 'how' of other races' power, I just worded it horribly and left out many of the finer details that you presented.

As for the being in control part re: Quincy, I think you're right. As I said, most of the stuff is just re-purposed RM. For the most part, what they choose to specialise in is highly subjective to the person. One thing to keep in mind is that Quincy are 99% of the case part of a Quincy family or clan (if you're not, what are you even doing). This is a very important factor. I talked earlier about how in my head, the Quincy were born from religion. That's the 'why' they chose (past tense) to kill Hollow and, for some, shinigami. It was against all they believed in. People died, they passed on and went to Heaven. Any such spirit who lingered on Earth did not conform to this idea and thus, did not belong. They grew into what could very, very easily be seen as demons as much as I detest the term. Therefore, it's not hard to say that the Quincy weaponised their autism and fought for their religion back in the old days.

Why they choose to kill Hollows even now? A belief so intrinsic to you or your family is hard to let go of. Look at Washington right now for a quick example of that. I imagine that throughout the generations the tradition was upheld, perhaps diluted to conform with modern times and remove the religion aspects from the teachings, but for many, one thing stuck: Hollow-breed and even the Shinigami, are 'evil' or 'unnatural'. The Culling is a very good justification for the latter nowadays, no matter who was at fault (hint: the Quincy). The former is also easily justified. The weaker Hollow they are familiar with eat Human souls, why would you not hate them for it? They are spiritually aware and carry those powers anyway, perhaps they see it as their burden to put an end to this or 'protect' the race. However they choose to act or view the spiritual world is completely up to them.

The specialisation (main power) and the Schrift, is an interesting topic, as you're right that it is a clear conscious choice. I think that's very subjective and can't really be defined racially as in the end, they're just regular humans who chose to wield these powers, but we can put a thought process behind it.

Choice is a common theme here but for many, it probably wasn't. Not the general path, at least. For many Quincy, training started early, it's all they knew growing up. Of course they led a normal life getting educated, but life at home was probably far from normal. How do you, as a little kid, go against the wishes of your family, assuming the family wanted their child to follow their footsteps? If the child doesn't, that's the end for their family's identity as a Quincy family. All they worked towards would end there. I doubt that's something the family would be happy about, but that's naturally dependant on family as with all things. They grew into the lifestyle, and something you learn so young is hard to shake off even in adulthood.

So, main power. It can be the result of a few things, I imagine. Either it is, as earlier stated in this thread, a family thing where it's taught as a kind of signature skill, or the person draws from what they need or think they need. That's a hard choice for a kid, assuming you're not a late-bloomer. When would you say the average Quincy chooses this specialisation, if at all? Thinking of it, why do we, as humans in the real world, choose a skill? Why do we choose the hobbies or specialisations we do, and why do they vary so much from person to person? Entertainment and money hardly factor into our case, so it's probably not that. I think, in the end, a Quincy chooses their main power based on what they think would help them best achieve their personal agenda. It's most likely something that's not innate, but a skill, or specialisation if you will, that's pursued because of highly personal reasons. For some that might be fun, like with Sasha. From their earlier post, we know that she likes to investigate and break things apart. Somewhere along the line she probably thought 'hey, I can do this with Reishi and it would probably be really effective'. Maybe someone else didn't have very good stamina, so instead of working on that they chose to artificially use Reishi as a supplement.

I completely agree with you on the Schrift, something like that should under no circumstances be something you're born with. That's absolute bullshit considering the whole free will aspects of humans. Shinigami and Hollow-breeds are special cases where what they are and how they came to be are facts. Humans don't have that leisure, and I don't like the idea of separating Quincy from Humans outside of their aptitude of manipulating Reishi. Is it something you are aware of, though? Probably not. I like Shun's take on this but that's also mainly because he brainwashed me into them.

Overall, any 'why' on these specialisations will be incredibly subjective and vary from case to case as long as it's not something innate. Can it be something innate? The Quincy bit in The World of Bleach Gotei states that it is an 'ability unique to the Quincy, a power born from their soul much like a Shinigami’s Shikai.' I personally don't agree with this, given my thoughts on the whole nature of the ability itself (reishi-based, yada yada). Maybe something they are 'naturally good at', but that's as far as I would personally stretch. I'd love to hear your thoughts on whether you think the ability should be something innate or not, I think that'd help a great deal already.






jesus fucking christ i need to learn how to get to the fucking point of things

no, as I stated earlier the only innate ability quincy have is the same innate ability all quincy have, which is the ability to manipulate spiritual particles as a mortal being (something which I really do hold is something genetic—which isn't to say it can't present in individuals from non-quincy families, but it's certainly a great deal less common in them)

the ability/specialization/shikai equivalent (= the BG power) is something they consciously decide to do (quite the opposite of shikai), as it's an application of the aforementioned reishi manipulation. The most ready example I can provide is Otto's power, a form of active camouflage he developed because he grew up doing a lot of hunting with his family in the north of sweden (and then found other, less legal uses for it). The defining idea here is that he decided that's what he wanted to devote himself to refining over the years more than any other aspect of his ability to manipulate reishi

as for what's in the rules, I kinda pretend the quincy stuff in particular isn't there because it's awful and quincy have always needed a real hard look which is partly why we're having this thread to maybe come to some sort of consensus on what the "norm" is for quincy characters so that we can use that going forward and better codify what is currently a very sloppily implemented race

Cool, so we agree on that front. I'd argue that RM could be taught to anyone should they train really hard, but that's not the point here.

So following your example, Otto has a highly personal power that's 'simply' another application of Reishi Manipulation. How do you propose this to be standardised or canonised, or what part of it? Having a power that really belongs to you and is personal to the character is common sense and shouldn't need to be a rule more so than a guideline. Hell, it's not even a rule for Shinigami, it'll just badly affect your grade if you don't follow it. This is already the case for Quincy and any other race going by the grading rubric.

Is it the 'specialised application of RM' part? If so, then I definitely agree.

you'd standardize/canonize it in the same way we've standardized/canonized how a zanpakuto relates to their wielder, which is to say in a very "soft" way: there are many acceptable approaches, but there is also one well-defined "best" approach

as for what part, it's absolutely "all quincy have RM, but their BG powers are the specialized and semi-unique applications of RM to achieve certain effects"

RM precedes the power and serves as the basis for it, and is simultaneously the common defining trait of the quincy race

that's my stance on the matter, anyway

To be honest, I've always seen as RM to be the core of everything spiritual. A Shinigami with fire manipulation, is he not just manipulating the Reishi in that spiritual (reishi!) fire? That's the real strength of the Quincy here, instead of specialising in something (be it innate or taught), they chose to stick to the core and build on the versatility of it. Naturally accompanied by a certain aspect they would then specialise in (BG Power).

I'm all for this, but I'd love to hear some more thoughts on the matter as well since this has come up an absolutely unreasonable amount but never reached a conclusion that most Quincy could stand behind. That's the real problem here, I think, trying to satisfy rather than make sense.