Application Update Discussion

what. did I get it wrong. or is my grammar wrong. I don't get it. x.x I was referring to what Shun said:

> Quincy powers are actually teachable

Both canon and BG have established that they are teachable, you were extremely correct Shura.

You could teach anyone Kido too. Sure, humans can come learn to be a Quincy but they would be doing exactly that, 'becoming' a Quincy.

-coughs- bleach.wikia.com/wiki/Kid%C5%8D

Shinigami Master Race will always & forever be more special than you mere mortals =3

It's merely Reiryoku.

it is kinda weird, though not really a problem to group all mortals under Quincy. Wouldn't it make more sense to have Variant actually be the special things they are meant to be, have Quincy be Quincy and then add another color for Fullbringer? Because isn't Quincy and Fullbringer the only option for mortals?

The problem being addressed is not distinction. The problem being addressed is the concentration of players, and the ability for them to do things together. History has shown us on BG that when you cordon people off into their own user groups, they generally stick to smaller circles.

The problem it creates is distinction, that lack of an identity you've now forced onto Quincy.

There's never been anything stopping Quincy and other humans interacting apart from the fact that they are not many in number as a whole.

EDIT: And the fact that the larger scale events tend to be focused around Shinigami and areas accessible mostly by Shinigami because of their numbers. 
N.B.: The above is not a dig at Shinigami at all, it's just the logical reason why things tend to play out that way.

I don't know how many different ways I can explain that the Quincy identity is 100% unchanged.  It's the Variant one that's been smushed.  Not a single thing changed about being a totally normal and average, blood-born Quincy.  Not a one.

If you're going to tell me with a straight face that players that would have been a Variant under the prior classification now flying a blue banner will actually diminish your ability to play a Quincy, then I don't even know what to say.  There is nothing stopping you from being as Quincy as you want to be. There never was, and there never will be.

Should we have separate user groups for each stage of Hollow Evolution!  By concentrating all Hollows under one color we have taken away their identity!

Or, by distinction of the function of their powers, skills, stats, and deeds they differentiate themselves.  Just like everyone else.

All Second-Life Souls capable of expressing a Zanpakuto are under Shinigami.

All Second-Life Souls afflicted by tragedy and burdened with an Aspect of Death are under Arrancar.

All Souls bound within flesh who are capable of spiritual sensitivity are under Quincy.

Either have a problem with all of that, or have a problem with none of that.

While I understand the point of reclassifying everything I do feel that there is a bit of a lack of appreciation for the nomenclature.

The reason an arrancar is called an arrancar is because the word Arrancar literally means rip off, as in their masks, then again I also don't like classifying all mortals under the quincy nomenclature as they are not quincy. The reason that they have their own names is because they are a subset of mortals while variant is a catch all that describes the things that don't fit into the primary three.

But, I'm probably just old fashioned.

Also can't really have a problem with shinigami as shinigami have no other classification than shinigami unlike Mortals and hollows.

I second this. I'll probably post more thoughts later, when I'm not at work.

I didn't say this earlier, as I was preparing for work, but if any of you have any specific complaints or ideas and would prefer talking to me one on one I'm most certainly available. I'll be at work with limited Internet for the next five hours, but don't that dissuade you!

Personally, I am not a fan of this. While it is true, Quincy are just mortals, they are mortals who have either chosen or been taught a very specific path for their development. You can call Jews, Christians, and Muslims monotheists, but I have a hard time believing they would not object to being lumped together under the same title because it is the little things, the details, the defining factors that set them apart that they care about, not the overarching themes that they happen to share. They have, quite literally, been to war with each other for millennia over these things. The minutia matters to people.

Be that as it may, if this is the direction staff is choosing to move in, to make Quincy the general mortal title, then the terminology of the application requires changes. As well as the terminology of the application. It is not that quincy can forgo racial skills for custom skills. It is that quincy can either create custom skills, or use the predefined skills provided. It should not be quincy cross in the power section, but spiritual focus. When the application is made to apply to a more generic group, the application itself should be modified to be more generic. In my opinion at least.

Also, dammit Bri. Your sig is as distracting as Tak's.

2/3 of these changes were sensible and done with every bit of good reasoning/logic behind them.

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Breaking down the history into three easy to fill out sections = excellent move and clarifies what you want to see out of an application's history. Streamlining takes time, but I feel you're on the right track with this.

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Hollow/Arrancar being lumped into one makes some sense to me. You can now start as an Adjuchas and not have to make a race change request if you want to break your mask-- could even make an argument that this could be a good 'halfway' point toward a second release/plot development point.

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When I said, "BG has integration issues that causes new players to have issue fitting in and progressing", I did not mean "Let's make this less difficult on staff and smash the two Earth groups together, that'll fix everything!"

Regarding the least populated races; that belongs solely to Quincy and Hollow/Arrancar and has for the better part of two years now in spite of your best efforts to discourage people from playing a flat out human with supernatural powers. Quincy have just recently gotten a major boost population wise (we'll see how long that lasts, love you guys but we all know history), and as we've seen in the requests?

Variants have continued to be more popular than both-- as seen by the growth of the KSN as a whole and the networking done as a result. This was not a wise decision to make on your part and smacks of the same tired bullshit we've seen in the past; "I hate Variants, they're an eyesore and I want to be rid of them, so let's find a way to do it that makes it look like we're genuinely giving a shit about the site."

Let's take it a step further and see the differences between the two races, shall we?:

Quincy have the ability to completely destroy a soul and gather their power from outside themselves due to a limited internal power source. They're abnormalities who don't fit into the cycle of souls and threaten to destroy it as a result. This offers a particular layer of plot for everyone in the Quincy group to have as a platform; your ass is hated and has been nearly wiped out by Shinigami multiple times because you shouldn't exist.

Fullbringers/Spiritually Aware Mortals are significantly more scarce/rare, but are not as much of as a surprise and threat to the balance-- unless you're a complete chaos agent like many of us who like to stick our noses in where it doesn't belong IC. Their power source is internal, not external the way a Quincy's is. Whether or not Variants/Fullbringers destroy souls is something no one can give a straight answer on and is pretty well up for interpretation per individual's headcanon. Plot wise? You're still an abnormality, but not one that puts an immediate "slated for Execution" stamp on your forehead due to being a threat to the cycle.

This is, has been, and always will be why the two were separated from the get go.

Integration is not an issue because of the differences between Quincy and Variant; it's an issue between the community and the attitudes of those within that make getting involved and progressing without blowing smoke up asses quite the difficult process.

"Variants have continued to be more popular than both" is hardly an apt comparison, and that's ignoring that they have the highest drop-off rate of any group.

But allow me to demonstrate why it's not a good comparison in the first place.

I have two baskets of fruit and you may take one fruit from either basket. One is a basket of apples, the other is a basket of every fruit except apples.

Yes, the other basket will be more popular day-to-day, because it's not a choice between one thing and one other thing. It's a choice between one thing and a bunch of other things.

I'm not super big on this aspect of the change, mind you. My reasons for not loving it, however, are equally as flimsy: Based on feelings.

Besides, I have other opinions: All other races are decidedly unimportant in Bleach (even Fullbringers got the smallest arc!) and everything that isn't Shinigami/Hollow/Quincy should simply be done away with. Why? If you want to play something not Bleach, go somewhere else. The continued existence of Variants is like letting people play aliens in an RPG about the American Civil War. And it's no wonder, to me, that the only two, decent Prestige Variants ever are both Shinigami.

EDIT: Actually, that'd be like saying that Sufficient Velocity is more popular than Bleach Gotei. Of course it is, Sufficient Velocity isn't limited to a single setting/franchise for roleplaying and storytelling.